Talk:Gray Fox
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[edit] Anti-Communist Group
Where exactly is it said that Frank Jaeger fought alongside an anti-communist guerrilla group in the Mozambican War of Independence? Because in that war, the only side that was anti-communist was Portugal, and they weren't a guerrilla group by any means. The guerrilla group in that war was Liberation Front of Mozambique (FRELIMO). Now there was Mozambican National Resistance (RENAMO), which was an anti-communist rebel group, but they fought in the the Mozambican Civil War in 1975, so that can't be right either… –Nahald 06:22, 23 February 2009 (UTC)
-Yes, it was FRELIMO who raised him as a child soldier. Big Boss clearly states he killed dozens of government soldiers so he had to have been fighting the portugese. However he states in MG2: Solid Snake that he also fought as a RENAMO soldier in 1975, where he was rescued by Big Boss from a FRELIMO prison camp. This would make alot of sense after MPO as it could be seen as him getting his own back on the group that raised him to be a killer.
Seconding that: in fact, Portable Ops specifically says that Frank had killed 'dozens of government soldiers', a clear indication that he fought for FRELIMO against the Portuguese regime. Gray Fox was a commie, no mistake. Thene 22:50, 26 February 2009 (UTC)
- According to everything we know about Fox, he fought both for and against FRELIMO at different points. I don't know if the creators put this much thought into it, but it stands to reason that he was forced to fight for FRELIMO as a child soldier during the Mozambican War of Independance (1964-1974) in 1966, then later joined RENAMO to fight against FRELIMO after the events of MPO (1970), during the Mozambican Civil War (1977-1992). Around this time, he would've also killed Naomi's parents in the neighboring country of Rhodesia, during the Rhodesian Bush War (1964-1979). It logically ties everything together without any need for retcons and is also historically accurate. FF-Suzaku 04:26, 19 March 2009 (UTC)
Yes, I actually like the revelation that he originally fought with FRELIMO as a child soldier as it makes the fact he later fought with RENAMO more significant. It suggests that the reason he returned to Mozambique and joined RENAMO was so he could get his revenge on the group that turned him into a killer. Makes sense. Then it makes sense that after Mozambique he crossed the border to Rhodesia and started fighting for the Rhodesian Governement (as they were the ones who created RENAMO in the first place). This when he ends up adopting Naomi.
However I noticed that the series tends to make some mistakes in regards to the dates. ie MGS1 says Fox encountered Naomi in Rhodesia during the guerilla fighting in the 80s, when the war actually ended in 1979. They do the same thing with Raiden and Solidus. Solidus claims he and Raiden fought in the Liberian civil war in the 80's when the war didnt even start till the end of 1989 and didnt really get into full swing until 1991.
[edit] Nationality?
After MPO is it still accurate to list Gray Fox's nationality as Vietnamese/German? It was originally stated that he was born in Vietnam to a german father and vietnamese mother and forced to work hard labour after the war, which is when he first met Big Boss. However this was entirely retconend in MPO (which made him older) so that they now met for the first time in the Mozambique Independence War. Frank Yaeger was also his real name originally(Yaeger coming from his father's side) where as in MPO we now know that it was more of a nickname given to him by FRELIMO. MPO just seems to make it seem like he was born in Mozambique, not Vietnam as was originally thought. Unless he was just brought to Mozambique when he was a child or something?
- They probably brought him from Vietnam to Mozambique as part of the people working as a POW in war (It's not uncommon for POWs, those forced to do hard labor, to be forced to participate in combat. I mean, during the Normandy invasions, the Germans often had Czech POWs placed in the front trenches as soldiers, BOX soldiers as they called them, like what happened during the beginning scene in "Saving Private Ryan".)
- EDIT: Also, The Vietnam War dates from 1959 to 1975. The Mozambican War of Independence was around from September 25, 1964 to June 25, 1975. Since Operation Snake Eater was completed on September 2nd, 1964, and the Mozambiquan Civil War started approximately 23 days later, and it's stated that he served in the Vietnam War, along with his serving in Vietnam for America the following year, it's possible that they had encountered each other there (not actually met, but still.). Plus, we know that Big Boss previously took a mission in 1960 in Vietnam [the very same mission that his war buddy and possibly best friend, Python, was apparantly killed.], so he could have easily met Gray Fox there (It's implied that his parents were killed during the early stages of the Vietnam War).
- As for his name Frank Jaegar, when was it actually stated that Frank Jaegar was actually his real name? I mean, Gray Fox's re-introduction to Snake during the events of Shadow Moses implied that he didn't have an actual name, and that the name Frank Jaegar wasn't actually his real name.
- EDIT2: All right, the MSX script for MG2:SS says it's his real name, but it doesn't mention anything about Jaegar being his family name. In fact, even back then, Kaisler hinted at the origin for his name as being a nickname, as his codename during the Mercenary Wars (the Zanzibar war for independence) was The Hunter, and he mentioned that Jaegar was German for Hunter.
[edit] Dexterity
Is he left handed? Ive only seen him in mgs 1 and he uses his left hand in that but that could be due to his lack of a right one. Oni Dark Link
- Well every picture on his page has him holding his swords in his right hand, so I'm going with no! --Fantomas 09:24, September 20, 2009 (UTC)
[edit] Franz Jaeger
Well i thought i would just make a note that his name, Frank Jaeger, is very similar to the name of a fictional strongbox manufacturer called Franz Jaeger from a series of swedish comedy-movies named Jönssonligan [1]. Hevehoc 15:22, October 20 2009 (CET)
