Talk:Revolver Ocelot

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Contents 1 Volgin Wha!? 2 gun 3 The Last Days of FOXHOUND 4 General Ivan 5 NSA? 6 Adam NOT Adamska 7 I'm not sure this is right 8 The Real Son of the Boss 9 Ocelot And Sergei Gurlukovitch

[edit] Volgin Wha!?

Ok, here's one little thing that bugged me about this article: colonel FREAKING VOLGIN raised ocelot? where the hell did THAT one come from? I'm pretty sure he was just the commander!ConceitVolatile 03:19, 12 January 2008 (UTC)

Urr, I'm not sure actually. I'll have to re-research it! --Fantomas 13:23, 9 January 2008 (UTC)

EVA says he was raised by GRU. And Colonel Volgin is the head of GRU... so...! But she's merely under that impression, and if Ocelot worked for the NSA she could be mistaken.--Aldrius 19:32, 17 June 2009 (UTC)

[edit] gun

dose any one no the modle gun he used before Big boss surgested he switched to a revolver User:Captain-One

ocerlots mother is the boss(the joy) and his farther is the sorrow

It looks like a Walther PP model. I've never seen confirmation though.Major Wolf 23:06, 7 June 2008 (UTC)

It's stated in the game that it's a Makarov --Drawde83 00:16, 8 June 2008 (UTC)

N== Philosophers in PO? ==

The wiki says, "Ocelot has become dissatisfied with the Philosophers bickering, which as pitted the CIA against the Pentagon for control of the legacy."

What were they bickering over? Between the CIA and the Pentagon? What role do they have between the dissent between the CIA and the Pentagon?

• The US Philosophers exerted their influence through the CIA and The Pentagon(as stated by Gene), therefore a powerstruggle between the the CIA & Pentagon basically amounts to infighting within the Philosophers.

When the CIA recovered half of the legacy after operation snake eater it caused a 'split' within the US Philosophers, which is why The Pentagon are trying to recover the missing half of the legacy for themselves during MPO.

So in a nutshell the US Philosophers are made up of two branches and the Pentagon branch is trying to one-up the CIA branch by discrediting them and recovering the remainder of the legacy. This is what the 'bickering' refers to.

[edit] The Last Days of FOXHOUND

I personally believe that not only should an entry be made for the webcomic "The Last Days of FOXHOUND" be made on here (Haloepedia has its own entry for Red vs. Blue, why not a similar fanwork?), but that each member of FOXHOUND (and other cast members) should get a sub-entry in their articles about their role and appearance in the comic. In this case, of course, there should be an entry on Revolver Ocelot. I already made an unsigned (and rather abridged) entry in the Liquid Snake article about his role in the comic and think Ocelot should have his own sub-entry for his role in the comic as well.

For the uninitiated, here is the comic in question: http://www.gigaville.com/listcomic.php

User:Crow T R0bot 22:48 22 July 2008 (EDT)

lets see, what makes you think there is a problem with having an article about "The Last Days of FOXHOUND"? (we have one for Metal Gear Awesome). I'm unfamiliar with the web comic you are talking about but I would recommend creating it's own article with all the information in it rather than spreading bits and pieces all over the place. Having said that if you want to contribute that information to the articles, go for it. The worst that can happen is it gets removed.

--Drawde83 03:11, 23 July 2008 (UTC)

My problem is that I have no prior experience with creating wiki articles and only a little experience with editing already existing ones. I will take your advice to hear though and do some research on how to make one before I ask someone else first, unless someone else would like to get on the ball with it.

--User:Crow T R0bot 00:58, 23 July EDT

[edit] General Ivan

While Vulcan Raven explicitly calls Ocelot "General Ivan" at one point during the FOXHOUND Rebellion, he says it in such a manner that it's used as a mocking term:

Ocelot: You see? I told you so. But I will kill him.
Raven: So, General Ivan, I hear he took your hand as well as your dignity.
Ocelot: Watch your tongue, Shaman!

Ocelot's reaction to the remark is obviously a reference that "General Ivan," as Raven called him, was simply a derogatory and outright racist and mocking remark alluding to Ocelot's nationality. Thus, it shouldn't be added as one of his aliases. -- Ocelot youth 19:00, 9 September 2008 (UTC)

Yeah, I reverted it at first because I had never heard Ivan used as a racist term for Russians. I did some research on the name and Wikipedia said it was similar to how Americans used the term "Charlie" for the Vietnamese during the Vietnam War. Since then I've pretty much stayed out of the whole argument. --Fantomas 20:19, 9 September 2008 (UTC)

Yeah, i dont know if you've ever played a game called Operation Flashpoint; but in that game theres a fictional conflict between the US and the Soviet Union during the Cold War and the Americans always refer to the russians collectively as 'Ivan'.

I've never even heard of that game, let alone played it. --Fantomas 14:33, 27 January 2009 (UTC)

[edit] NSA?

Is it really neccesarry to put NSA as one of his affiliations? I'm pretty sure he was just posing as an NSA codebreaker when he 'defected' to the soviet union and was never actually part of the organisation.

I was the one that put that info. The games and database never actually say he never worked for the NSA. They only say that he was an NSA codebreaker. The database even mentions how Ocelot and the real EVA appeared on a news program in Moscow. Here's the database info.

"NSA Defection Incident"

"In September 1960, two people who had worked as code breakers at NSA Headquarters appeared on a news program in Moscow. They announced their defection to the Soviet Union and disclosed NSA's cryptanalytic missions. This was the first incident to reveal the truth behind NSA to the world."

I do admit though that it would be pretty odd for a 16 year old to work for the NSA. Anyway, you are probably right. I'm guessing the Philosophers had Ocelot and the real EVA to pretend to work for the NSA in order to get the Philosopher's Legacy. The defection part was obviously a facade.

Anyway, I've removed the references.

I didn't see this when I reverted you edits, you made it sound like you had just heard it somewhere! I don't feel like we have enough here to flat out remove the parts where it says he worked for the NSA. Perhaps we should just put that he posed as one, despite the fact that it's almost like we're just assuming that he posed as one. It's not too much of a stretch to see him working for them, and it's pssible he got the job at such a young age because of his connections to The Boss. I'm not sure. I've re-reverted the edits until we can decide on something. --Fantomas 17:51, 26 March 2009 (UTC)

It's okay. Thanks. I wish the database had cleared it up but it didn't.

[edit] Adam NOT Adamska

Everyone needs to stop listing his name as Adamska, as its actually a female name. EVA calls him 'Adam' in MGS4 and as the two had known eachother for many years it can be assumed that its his proper name. He probably just said his name was Adamska in MGS3 because he was supposed to be Russian, it was a way of maintaining his cover.

Or maybe Kojima didn't know it was a female name? EVA most likely called him ADAM because that was his code-name he used during Snake Eater. --Fantomas 12:49, 26 March 2009 (UTC)

The database says his name IS Adamska. Adam is just the American version of it.

[edit] I'm not sure this is right

The article claims that the Liquid Snake in Ocelot's head was wholly a fabrication, but that doesn't seem correct; while it isn't the Liquid Snake, it appears he has a second personality which is a Liquid Snake, as he remembers things Ocelot didn't witness (most obviously, he recalls Liquid's death). There's further precident in that the copy of Psycho Mantis in Screaming Mantis' head also remembers things witnessed by nobody but him and Snake. By this, it seems that it's possible in the MGS-verse to copy someone's entire personality and memories and somehow implant it into someone else; the new personality being as real as the original, perhaps overruling but not replacing the old one. The arm, presumably, was a cover story so the Liquid personality didn't become suspicious of its origins. Evil Tim 06:45, 20 May 2009 (UTC)

In Metal Gear Solid 4, it was indeed a fabrication. Most likely Ocelot claimed these thing due to memories of while Liquid Snake possessed him in Metal Gear Solid 2 (as it is heavily implied that Ocelot was aware of what he was doing while being possessed, such as briefly resuming his composure to bite his/Liquid's arm and shouting "Get... Out... Of... My... Head... LIQUID!!!!".) So if he's aware of his actions while possessed, he might as well remember some of Liquid's memories, INCLUDING his last few moments at life, without actually having Liquid's consciousness in him. I mean, take Samantha Carter from Stargate SG1, for example. After having been a host for a Tok'ra for a brief while, and after it sacrificed itself to save her, she has the memories of that Tok'ra as well, even knowing how to use Gou'al'oud Technology and sensing a Gou'al'oud nearby.

But the MGS2 Liquid and the MGS4 Liquid are the same thing; either it was always Liquid Snake (MGS4 certainly suggests that wasn't the case), was a copy of Liquid Snake's mind convinced it was the real one (which is what I got from 4), or Ocelot made the whole thing up. Regardless, nothing changed between 2 and 4, and the 'magic hand' apparently wasn't posessing him at any point in either game. Evil Tim 12:32, 22 May 2009 (UTC)

Since Liquid had nanomachines during MGS, they could have recorded everything he did and thought up until his death, allowing Ocelot to access his entire personality and memories when his corpse was retrieved. This could also mean that he wasn't faking the "take-overs" he suffered during MGS2, as they could have been adverse reactions to the nanomachines he was using to program himself with Liquid's personality. In that case, we might consider the Liquid portion to be a separate entity unto itself, perpetuated and controlled by the nanomachines (meme), while Ocelot is represented by his own mind (gene). Oreng3 05:24, 23 May 2009 (UTC)

But I don't recall any example of Nanomachines having such a capability in the MGS universe, and the plot reveals regarding the Magic Hand in 4 are pretty clear that the arm itself wasn't the cause of the new personality, it was deliberately inserted and the arm added afterwards. This is borne out in that we also have a personality added without a body part addition (there's no evidence any part of Psycho Mantis was grafted onto Screaming Mantis) and body part additions that don't change the host's personality (Big Boss shows no signs of being posessed by Liquid). Evil Tim 06:49, 23 May 2009 (UTC)

Well, Liquid WAS posses by Liquid in Metal Gear Solid 2. This was probably because he's the son of The Sorrow, and it's easy to assume he inherited some of the The Sorrow's abilities. But he was only posses when he was near Solid Snake. After the events of Metal Gear Solid 2 Ocelot had the arm removed, and replaced with a cybernetic one. He used nanomachines and hypnotherapy to "become" Liquid. So while Liquid really WAS in control of him in MGS2, that isn't the case in MGS4. As for the events that only Liquid and Snake knew about... It's possible that Ocelot witnessed those too. He could have been nearby and seen them for all we know. We don't really know WHERE he was near the end of the first game, so it's possible that he could have been watching from nearby, just a theory. Though I think the theory about Ocelot having Liquid's memories after being possessed might be true too. Yoyoddd 19:07 (UTC)

Liquid never possessed Ocelot. This was made very clear in MGS4.

[edit] The Real Son of the Boss

Everyone knows that Ocelot is really The Boss's son, Adamska, but what I wanna know is where and when was this revealed? I don't remember them saying this in MGS3 or MGS4, when was the information of Ocelot being The Boss's son revealed?

There is a conversation with EVA after you fight Ocelot in MGS3 where she mentions that he is the son of a legendary soldier (explaining why he became a Major at such a young age) and that his mother has a snake shaped scar. At the end of MGS3, The Boss reveals she has a snake shaped scar. --Fantomas 00:11, 4 July 2009 (UTC)

[edit] Ocelot And Sergei Gurlukovitch

When exactly did Ocelot meet Sergei Gurlukovitch? did they meet around the time during metal gear solid 3? because i heard they both served in the Spetsnaz GRU....

And it said they met up after Shadow Moses. what did they do together during that time before the tanker incident.

And was Sergei Gurlukovitch acquainted with Solidus Snake at all? because he seemed like he knew Ocelot was "in league" with him.

And Did Ocelot ever really work for Liquid Snake or Solidus Snake? and if not what was the point of aligning himself with them??

I think a lot of these topics were left as a mystery on purpose. Therefore they don't explain them any further in any of the games and you'll have to come up with your own theories. anyway here's what I think.

Sergei is never mentioned in MGS3 and I'm unsure of him being in spetsnaz.

see response on Solidus talk page.

Sergei and his forces were supposed to reinforce Shadow Moses but they didn't make it in time.

No he was working for the patriots the whole time. His role was always to control the outcome of events in The Patriots favour. He could only do that by aligning with them.

--Drawde83 21:15, 5 August 2009 (UTC)

Wait, I thought Revolver Ocelot was actually trying to fulfill Big Boss's dream of stopping the Patriots in their Tracks (like what was stated in MGS4)?

Well that makes it a little more difficult. Sergei wasn't involved in MGS4 so we are getting away from the original question. I suppose Ocelot's real motive (remember just my opinion) was to stop the patriots without ruining the world. remember how Sunny's virus removed the control parts of the system while keeping the parts that prevented anarchy. --Drawde83 21:59, September 23, 2009 (UTC)